'66 Deluxe

WideFive
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Re: '66 Deluxe

Post by WideFive » Sat Nov 09, 2019 8:41 am

wwebner wrote:
Sat Nov 09, 2019 7:32 am
Is that JB weld on the cyl studs that are tapped through the case?
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"There is no restoration process that can give a car legitimacy equal to originality."

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Dual Port
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Re: '66 Deluxe

Post by Dual Port » Thu Dec 19, 2019 10:50 am

Been taking my time doing this as winter's here, took a couple of trips, worked on the Vette for a couple of weeks so now I'm back at it. I can't let Bill get ahead of me in the engine race.

I miked the crank bearings, they measured exactly the same as a new set I have on the shelf. I did change out the cam bearings, chucked up the cam and polished the journals with 1000 grit to a fine mirror finish.
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I had some machine work done on the cam for clearance for the stroker crank, new German lifters go on the cam with the gooey lube, clean the flanges with brakeclean and seal the case...
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And it goes together, it spins as free as a bird.
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Pics of the 92s next to a stock 85.5.
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This engine only had a couple of thousand miles on it so it's like new inside. Not only did the mains show no wear but the rings are a tight .017" which is probably .015 or .016" actually. Spec is .012-.018" with a wear limit of .035" so they qualify as "new". There was zero carbon in the ring grooves, which is important for ring sealing. Jugs look perfect with hone marks still present so I'm not messing with them.
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Lube and install the rings, clean the case deck and base of the jugs with brakeclean and put a smear of RTV on the base of the jugs.
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Heads go on with a bit of Permatex under the lower washers to prevent oil seeping from the stud area.
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Bruce Amacker
'66 Deluxe Bus
'65 Standard Bus

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Dual Port
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Re: '66 Deluxe

Post by Dual Port » Thu Dec 19, 2019 11:39 am

Reseal the CB/JayCee adjustable pushrods.
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As soon as I install heads and jugs I always pressure test or do a leakdown to verify the cylinders are tight. This is as tight as it gets, only a few % leakage on all 4.
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Install the Empi 1.5 quart sump. Like most Empi products the quality is a bit low so fitting is needed- figuring where the interference is which required grinding on both the case and the sump for clearance. I used a .0015" feeler gauge to verify the flange met all the way around, and RTV for the install. I put one on Bus 2 with Curil T that leaked.
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Stock screen and silicone gaskets on the sump plate.
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The intake runners on the manifold are larger than stock which means a stock boot won't fit. The neoprene hoses I installed before were "supposed" to be gasoline resistant, but I guess they were not. :( I wonder if the engine burped as it ingested these chunks of rubber a few years ago, I really don't remember.
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Getting parts painted for the upper stuff.
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Because it's a stroker the exhaust is short by about 5-6mm, modification needed.
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This is where I'm at, more to come.
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Bruce Amacker
'66 Deluxe Bus
'65 Standard Bus

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Six Volt
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Re: '66 Deluxe

Post by Six Volt » Fri Dec 20, 2019 1:21 pm

When you're further along, let's hear about that carb set up.
It's me, Sean
1957 Beetle Oval Sedan 36 Horse 6 volt
1959 Panel 40 Horse 6 volt
1969 Standard 1600 and 6 volts too many.

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Dual Port
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Re: '66 Deluxe

Post by Dual Port » Sun Dec 29, 2019 12:59 pm

The muffler looks pretty normal right?
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Until you flip it over and see the surgical scars.
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First the baffles have to come out of #1 and 3 ports, this takes an acetylene torch and a screwdriver.
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It's hard to believe the engine can even breathe through these.
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Then cut open the back and see how the baffles are set up. I've done this a bunch of times and found that manufacturers use many different ways to baffle the exhaust. I made the center hole first, torched a big hole in the baffle tube, then used a borescope to look around more. I saw a divider plate near the ends so I had to cut twice more to be able to cut a big hole in those. In the end I didn't need to make the center hole but not a big deal.
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Because cutting the baffles out eliminates flow through the manifold heat tube, I weld a small diverter flap in the port to force exhaust under the carb. This makes the engine run MUCH better.
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Why do I go to all of this grief to modify a stock muffler? Because in the past I've bought numerous headers, performance mufflers and systems and was never happy with the first purchase. Either they're too loud, hang too low, don't fit my oil pump, or some other grief. On the Ghia I ended up buying several systems and ditching them to make my own. Even then I had to open the muffler up and modify the baffles to make it quieter- it was a big oval Magniflow can but had zero baffling inside. On the mufflers I've modified for my busses I'm happy with the noise level and flow. I'm sure they don't flow like a header but they're not obtrusively loud or resonant/buzzy, either.
The exhaust and trim is now done so it's time to prime the oil system. Because I use a filter pump I just pump oil into the filter outlet. I'm surprised how much oil it takes to pressurize the galleys, this gets the bearings wet before spinning the engine. There's no way around doing this without making a big f'ing mess. I use 0w-20 to prime the galleys and 0w-40 Mobil 1 in the sump.
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I then prime the pump and spin it over with the spark plugs out to get oil pressure without load on the rods. I quickly get 30+psi cranking. I did a compression test before putting the plugs in, all 4 are at 140psi. :D

It runs! And it runs great. The carb is a Zenith 32NDIX 2bbl that's used (in pairs) on early Porsche 356s. It sits on a vintage Deano manifold, probably from the 70's or 80's. I had Art Thraen build it about 10 years back, by the way the plugs look and the fuel economy, I'd say he nailed the jetting. I did run an (LM1?) on it when it was in the Ghia to verify fuel trim, it was great.

Ignore the dist, Sean asked me to try it for him. It will have a mechanical when it goes in the bus as my 32NDIX doesn't have ported vacuum. (BTW, the advance curve was surprisingly nice on that cheapy. I'll run it on my dist machine later for S&G but it was about 20° total mechanical starting about 1200 and all in about 2800 with about 8° vac) I had a Pertronix electronic in it before, it will probably go back in.

Oil pressure is 50psi all the time, I cranked the idle down to where it almost stalled and it was still 30 hot. Noise level is not bad but a little louder than my others because of the bigger displacement. Throttle response is RIGHT NOW.
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The best thing is that there are zero oil leaks! YEA!
Bruce Amacker
'66 Deluxe Bus
'65 Standard Bus

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Dual Port
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Re: '66 Deluxe

Post by Dual Port » Wed Feb 12, 2020 12:10 pm

Dual Port wrote:
Sun Dec 29, 2019 12:59 pm
The best thing is that there are zero oil leaks! YEA!
Well, not exactly zero leaks. :( I cheated and did not pull P&C #3and 4 off to change the cam and it bit me. After several hours on the run stand jugs #3 and 4 started leaking where they join the case. Because it's a big bore the sealing flange is very thin there near the studs so I think that's where it was seeping. Very little leakage, definitely acceptable to many people but it's winter and there's no rush to complete it.
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I used a UV dye light and Napa UV oil to locate it.
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It's difficult to shoot pictures of UV leaks with a camera but here's what a couple of drops of oil look like on the floor and the head looks like during teardown.
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Sidebar: A couple of days after I shot those pics I had severe irritation in one eye that seemed like a chunk of debris had gotten into it. I thought this was very odd because I'm so fussy about wearing safety glasses at the shop. I went to the doc and what does he do for diagnosis? Put UV dye in my eye and use a UV light to look for damage. I thought that was funny. He didn't find anything, prescribed drops and all is well. :mrgreen: I'm thinking I scratched it in my sleep.
Bruce Amacker
'66 Deluxe Bus
'65 Standard Bus

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Karl Kombi
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Re: '66 Deluxe

Post by Karl Kombi » Wed Feb 12, 2020 3:31 pm

I went to the doc and what does he do for diagnosis? Put UV dye in my eye and use a UV light to look for damage.
This reminds me of the gel that dentists use to etch the enamel of a tooth prior to bonding. It's NAVAL JELLY!! The manufacturers bottle it in 16 oz. bottles ($7.00) for sale in Lowe's etc. for rust removal, and also bottle it in 9 ml (0.3 oz.) bottles ($62.00) for sale through dental suppliers for tooth bonding.
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Every dentist I know buys exactly one tiny "dental" bottle for the office and refills it with the same stuff from the big box stores. :D

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Dual Port
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Re: '66 Deluxe

Post by Dual Port » Sun Mar 01, 2020 12:04 pm

Wow, I've been challenged by a tough one here. The 2180 is bone dry, has 10+ hours on the run stand to prove it, and is ready to go in. I prep the flywheel and pressure plate with a DA like I always do. I put the 1700 lb Kennedy Stage 1 clutch PP I used on it in the Ghia with a new solid hub disc and stick it in. Everything is great except the clutch chatters like a bitch on engagement. :evil:
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Back out it comes. From prior experience 90% of the time you have chatter the problem is the disc, I have a new spring hub disc in stock so I figured I'd try that. For S&G I checked runout of the FW, it's .000" with .005" end play in the crank.
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NFG, still chatters like a bitch.

The Bowden tube "looks" OK, it's OEM and only 5 years old but let's take a closer look, Maybe the slack isn't enough so let's pull it out (not always easy :roll: I had to loosen the powertrain and move it back like I'm doing a tranny mount), I have a new one in stock so let's put that in and shim it correctly. The cable looks like brand new and is well lubed.
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NFG, still chatters like a bitch.

Back out with the engine, I'll put the stock clutch from the 1904 on it even though I know it probably won't hold the 2180.
Last edited by Dual Port on Sun Mar 01, 2020 3:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Bruce Amacker
'66 Deluxe Bus
'65 Standard Bus

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Dual Port
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Re: '66 Deluxe

Post by Dual Port » Sun Mar 01, 2020 12:14 pm

Examining the PP shows nothing, it has only a few thousand miles on it when in the Ghia and worked great. The collar is level, the spring is not cracked, no visual cues.
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I DA the FW and PP again, the gland nut bearing feels great, I always put a dab of high temp silicone grease in them before installation.
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It doesn't chatter with the stock PP in it driving it around the parking lot. (YEA!) I can't really drive it on the road because of salt right now to see if it will hold the torque of the engine, but I doubt it will. I put about 200 miles on it last weekend when the roads were dry and it runs great!

I emailed Kennedy to see if they can test the PP and tell me why it's chattering. I see a new clutch in my future.

I'm tired of pulling the F'ing engine in and out of the bus right now. Thank God I have a lift, I'd be even more cranky :twisted: if I was doing this on the floor.
Bruce Amacker
'66 Deluxe Bus
'65 Standard Bus

WideFive
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Re: '66 Deluxe

Post by WideFive » Sun Mar 01, 2020 4:08 pm

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No Bus leaves my shop without welding that tube down.
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"There is no restoration process that can give a car legitimacy equal to originality."

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