'65 Standard

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Dual Port
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Re: '65 Standard

Post by Dual Port » Sun Oct 14, 2018 6:26 pm

Following Sean's lead I've been looking at disc brake kits, both of my busses won't stop like modern cars and if I get into a panic stop situation bad things will happen. I read Samba stuff and looked at the kits available, it matters greatly what wheels you're running as some of them won't work with stock wheels. (Why would they do that?) I'm running stock 14" wheels on both of my busses. I've installed two kits on Beetles in the last few years, a SoCal kit on Sean's Oval and a CB kit on Trailmix's '66 beetle. Both left something to be desired as far as quality goes. The SoCal kit gave us hoses that wouldn't work, and the CB kit had a defective hub and defective rotor with excessive runout on both of them. See previous posts if you want more info.

Sean popped for the CSP (German) kit from WW which looked like great quality parts that Kirk installed. I opted for the cheaper AC kit from SoCal. They had a "misprint" in the HVW mag they honored and I got them for $720 with no tax and free shipping. Thinking I could always return one if I didn't like it and needed them for both busses, I bought 2. Current price is $799 walk in and $899 phone.

They come complete with new wheel bearings, seals, hardware, MC, reservoir, and hoses. It's all Chinese, here's what they looked like coming out of the boxes:
PA080175.JPG
PA080176.JPG
PA110075.JPG
They claim replacement parts are available locally, but have not responded to my e-mail asking what they fit or industry part numbers.

The rotors are very heavy (good), fully ventilated. They are one piece, not separate rotor/hub.
PA080173.JPG
I knock the races in.
PA080180.JPG
PA080184.JPG
I had some spare spindles and wanted to mock them up on the bench before tearing my bus apart, so start by cleaning the flanges and threads:
PA080163.JPG
PA080165.JPG
Bolt the caliper mounting bracket on (both adapters and calipers are L/R)
PA090001.JPG
PA100038.JPG
Using the supplied gr 10.9 bolts and lockwashers.
Bruce Amacker
'66 Deluxe Bus
'65 Standard Bus

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Dual Port
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Re: '65 Standard

Post by Dual Port » Sun Oct 14, 2018 6:38 pm

Fearing the worst about Chinese quality I wanted to measure runout before tearing my bus down. I was really surprised to found no runout at all, less than .001" on the rotor or wheel face on both rotors.
PA110063.JPG
PA110069.JPG
And parallelism on the rotor was also under .001".
PA100018.JPG
Here it is mocked up,
PA100057.JPG
PA100043.JPG
I use a 15" Beetle wheel on both of my busses for a spare so I wanted to see if that fits, and it does with plenty of clearance.
PA100053.JPG
PA100046.JPG
If you need to take the caliper off you need a skinny 15mm to fit on the slide. Most of my 15s would not fit.
PA110072.JPG
The wheel studs are "flanged" (?) so they won't thread all the way through and Allen keyed for ease of installation. I Loctited them into the rotors. They also use an appropriate lug nut and not a separate ball washer like some silly setups I've seen.
Bruce Amacker
'66 Deluxe Bus
'65 Standard Bus

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Dual Port
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Re: '65 Standard

Post by Dual Port » Sun Oct 14, 2018 6:44 pm

On to the bus and it's the same procedure, clean the flange and holes. This was done last year so they looked like new when I unbolted the drum brakes.
PA110093.JPG
PA110094.JPG
Bolt on the adapter with Loctite and torque to spec. They give clear instructions along with torque specs.
PA110089.JPG
Here it is done:
PA110096.JPG
PA110100.JPG
Bleed using a vacuum setup:
PA110103.JPG
The MC reservoir fit really well, I didn't even have to adjust the pushrod as clearance was about 1mm. I bled and adjusted the rears as well.
PA160003.JPG
PA160005.JPG
The hoses clear everything from lock-to-lock, no rubbing on tierods or anything.

I have about 60 miles on it since complete and am really happy. It was easier to install than I would have guessed, and I'd give the kit an "A" rating. Excellent!

It stops MUCH faster than it used to with similar pedal pressure. I would recommend this to anyone with a split bus. :D
Last edited by Dual Port on Tue Oct 16, 2018 6:27 pm, edited 4 times in total.
Bruce Amacker
'66 Deluxe Bus
'65 Standard Bus

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Six Volt
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Re: '65 Standard

Post by Six Volt » Sun Oct 14, 2018 6:50 pm

Can't wait to find out how these work out. At 1/2 the price of what I paid for the CSP kit, they'll be a better deal if they work out.
I think disc kits are an absolute necessity in today's world for split bus owners. Not so much because of our vehicles, but because of the way Millennials drive. Millennials have a cell phone in their face while they go 20mph over the speed limit and ride 10 feet behind the car in front of them. Then they cut in front of a 50+ year old bus to get to an exit lane they should have been aware of two miles earlier. My son may be the exception, but I know his generation. :roll:
It's me, Sean
1957 Beetle Oval Sedan 36 Horse 6 volt
1959 Panel 40 Horse 6 volt
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TRL
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Re: '65 Standard

Post by TRL » Sun Oct 14, 2018 7:00 pm

Six Volt wrote:
Sun Oct 14, 2018 6:50 pm
Can't wait to find out how these work out. At 1/2 the price of what I paid for the CSP kit, they'll be a better deal if they work out.
I think disc kits are an absolute necessity in today's world for split bus owners. Not so much because of our vehicles, but because of the way Millennials drive. Millennials have a cell phone in their face while they go 20mph over the speed limit and ride 10 feet behind the car in front of them. Then they cut in front of a 50+ year old bus to get to an exit lane they should have been aware of two miles earlier. My son may be the exception, but I know his generation. :roll:
Millenials are actually good at texting and driving. We’ve been doing it since day one. Its old people who try to keep up with the young kids that creates problems. Having only recently started trying to text and drive those old people are all over the place. Mostly because they cant read anything on a phone without their glasses, which they left at home, so it takes a while to decipher that blurry mess. :lol:
On a different note the kit looks good Bruce! Was there a change in front track width?
The Rick Lang

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Marla
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Re: '65 Standard

Post by Marla » Mon Oct 15, 2018 7:03 am

You keep the drums on the rear then and just do the discs in the front? If you take the drums off the front can they be used as spares for the rear if needed down the road?
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Dual Port
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Re: '65 Standard

Post by Dual Port » Mon Oct 15, 2018 8:57 am

T: Track width is the same using the kit.

M: None of the parts interchange between the front and rear brakes. There is huge weight transfer when braking so front brakes on most cars take 60-80% of the braking during a panic stop. Rear brakes are never the same size on any car (that I can think of), front brakes are always larger, even on a rear engine bus it's biased towards the front.

Edit: SoCal wrote back today and said the pads and cal kits fit an 89-98 Jetta. That's cal kits, not calipers, so I assume they're using a custom caliper housing that uses Jetta guts. With a little luck I'll never need them. ;)
Bruce Amacker
'66 Deluxe Bus
'65 Standard Bus

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Karl Kombi
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Re: '65 Standard

Post by Karl Kombi » Mon Oct 15, 2018 8:22 pm

Thanks for the pics. The setup looks real nice -- the castings don't even look too "Chinese". ;) You answered a question I had regarding the pads -- if they're readily available (from what "newer" car).

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douge
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Re: '65 Standard

Post by douge » Mon Oct 15, 2018 10:12 pm

Many thanks Bruce for this info on early bus / disc brake conversion. It seems that I need this most on the KI trips. As I approach Marblehead, the traffic gets congested & drivers become impatient & careless. A front end collision with a VW bus would be a BAD thing.
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wwebner
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Re: '65 Standard

Post by wwebner » Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:05 am

I see your AC kit from SoCal is single piston caliper. Is the CSP kit also single piston?

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