Austin's 1977 Tintop Camper

Kooper271
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Re: Austin's 1977 Tintop Camper

Post by Kooper271 »

wwebner wrote:Looks like you've been busy today. Next step is clean,clean,clean. Curious. Do you have a bolt on cam gear? which would mean the cam had been replaced at some point.
Nope, rivets.

On the crank, the #2 bearing (the one that is in 2 halves, if #2 isnt the correct terminology) was stuck. Wouldn't rotate at all around the crankshaft while the other 3 rotate freely. Is this normal?
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Mike Kever Kombi
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Re: Austin's 1977 Tintop Camper

Post by Mike Kever Kombi »

Nope.
Should spin free. The 2 piece main bearing is actually slightly out of round until correct torque. Could be what you are noticing, probably not though.

Is it tough to spin or does not spin at all?

Did the bearing remain in the case halves or on crank?

What's the surface of the bearing look like on the face that meets crank? Is it shiny? Does it have grooves or scratches running parallel? Does it have a hot spot? Is there heat discoloration?

What's the back side look like? Are there scratches? How does the dowel hole look, stilI round? Are there any other indents from where something may have got in between case and bearing. Does it have size listed (std)?

How bout the case half dowel. Are they still snug and are the holes perfectly round or are the "warbled"? Run your finger nail across journal, does it "click"? It should be buttery smooth

Crank journal. Is it all dirty? Are there any scratches? Does it have some flash rust? Probably needs polished regardless.

Have you tried lubricant on the crank/bearing and spinning? Are you holding it together correctly?

Do you have a dial indicator and magnetic base? You can set crank back in case and measure run off/out.

Good job so far. I don't know what access you have to cleaners, but a good homebrew recipe is a 50/50 mix of lacquer thinner and mineral spirits. Scrape as much as you can, then use mixture. Use purple power degreaser afterwards to get rid of "tarnish" that the cleaner won't remove. I use carb cleaner and air during assembly. Some use brake cleaner.

Can't wait to see reassembly. Have you got the parts ready to go yet?
Mike

1961 Microbus
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1971 Super Beetle (1302s)


1975 Westfalia
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Sarcasm is just one of the many services I offer.

I like my water filtered through a bed of grains, cleansed by yeast, and preserved with hops.
Kooper271
Posts: 197
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Re: Austin's 1977 Tintop Camper

Post by Kooper271 »

Mike Kever Kombi wrote:Nope.
Is it tough to spin or does not spin at all?

Did the bearing remain in the case halves or on crank?

What's the surface of the bearing look like on the face that meets crank? Is it shiny? Does it have grooves or scratches running parallel? Does it have a hot spot? Is there heat discoloration?

What's the back side look like? Are there scratches? How does the dowel hole look, stilI round? Are there any other indents from where something may have got in between case and bearing. Does it have size listed (std)?

How bout the case half dowel. Are they still snug and are the holes perfectly round or are the "warbled"? Run your finger nail across journal, does it "click"? It should be buttery smooth

Crank journal. Is it all dirty? Are there any scratches? Does it have some flash rust? Probably needs polished regardless.

Have you tried lubricant on the crank/bearing and spinning? Are you holding it together correctly?

Do you have a dial indicator and magnetic base?

Have you got the parts ready to go yet?
Doesnt spin at all.

They remained on the crank

Heat discolored, scratches, and a nick on the inside.

The backs look good. Pass the fingernail test. Original VW size STD.

Case halves feel and look good. Dowel pins fit well.

Crank journals look great. Not dirty or rusty and they pass the fingernail test.

I'm not sure how to spin them correctly. I probably am not.

I do have a dial indicator and base. I know what my next step is then.

Nope, waiting to see exactly what i need per your recommendation. Only things I've bought are things that were broken or should be replaced so far.
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wwebner
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Re: Austin's 1977 Tintop Camper

Post by wwebner »

"Do you have a dial indicator and magnetic base? You can set crank back in case and measure run off/out."

You may have a bit of trouble using a magnetic base on an aluminum case.
You could rig your fixture thru a case thru bolt hole. Or take it to a machine shop. Or if you are sending it to DPR,they can check it out.
While it is rare that the T4 cases need align boring, your #2 bearing issue and the dark spots I see in the bearing saddles
would have me checking the case, for out of round main bearing journals. A quick check is to take a new bearing and fit it in the journal without the dowel. This is just a quick check and will usually only show large problems. Again,best to take it to a good machine shop who can use a bore gauge and check for our of round. They will have to have the case hardware, and torque specs.
Kooper271
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Re: Austin's 1977 Tintop Camper

Post by Kooper271 »

I have a bore gauge so i will check the case tonight
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Mike Kever Kombi
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Re: Austin's 1977 Tintop Camper

Post by Mike Kever Kombi »

I always mount the magnetic base on yoke, or part of stand, as they are steel. Keep your end bearings, but not center bearing (2 piece) on and set crank in case, set up dial indicator and slowly rotate crank. This may tell you if it is even worth having crank redone or just buying new counter weighted from Bill.

Case bolts must be torqued before running bore gauge down case.

The bare minimum in parts for bottom end are main bearings, cam bearings (get silver line. Others have had problems fitting), connecting rod bearings, 2.0 liter engine gasket kit, front and rear main seals, camshaft and gear, and lifters.

Optional are new counter weighted crank, gear stack on crank, connecting rods, distributor drive pinion, push rods, cam plug, and fly wheel.

Never reuse Type 4 cam unless you know it's history. Never replace cam without lifters or vice versa. Always order lifters and cam as matched sets when possible. Same hardness.
Mike

1961 Microbus
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1971 Super Beetle (1302s)


1975 Westfalia
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Sarcasm is just one of the many services I offer.

I like my water filtered through a bed of grains, cleansed by yeast, and preserved with hops.
chuckspence
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Re: Austin's 1977 Tintop Camper

Post by chuckspence »

Austin you need to get moving on this if you're going to make it to Kelleys Island, or just drive whatever you have and tent camp, way too much thinking going on with this build already, your crank & case are fine just polish the crank and slam in a new set of main bearings, (if your crank isn't good I'll give you another one) don't go too overboard worrying about all the minuscule bottom end details, your type 4 bottom end will outlast at least 2 sets of heads/valve jobs, we've seen center main bearing wear like yours a few times now, but I'm not sure how bad yours is (add photo here, this is your job, Austin), your cam looked good, but replace it anyway, with new lifters, don't worry about getting the lifters matched to your cam as long as they're both new (most T4 cam mfg's just make cams, lifers come from other sources), and where were you last Saturday? I thought you were going to catch up to the cruise at the brewery... that's all I've got to say at this time....
Kooper271
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Re: Austin's 1977 Tintop Camper

Post by Kooper271 »

Alright guys, ill work on this and update as i have time. More pictures this evening.

Chuck,
No plans to have this ready for Kellys island. I bought a tent for my girlfriend and I. Her grandmother's colon burst and she is in the ICU so i dont have much free time right now. I missed the cruise last weekend for a family emergency.
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Kooper271
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Re: Austin's 1977 Tintop Camper

Post by Kooper271 »

#2 main bearing saddles:
#2 saddle1.jpg
#2 saddle 2.jpg

#2 main bearings
#2 bearings.jpg
#2 crank journal
#2 crank journal.jpg
#2 crank journal2.jpg
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Kooper271
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Re: Austin's 1977 Tintop Camper

Post by Kooper271 »

Tonight I want to clean up the case. 50/50 mix of lacquer thinner and mineral spirits as recommended by Mike above.


My rod bearings and main bearings have uneven wear patterns so I'm going to take everything to Gable's Machine Shop in Akron to be inspected. They did an excellent job rebuilding my Jetta heads a couple years ago.
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